Matt Kibbe talks with Li Schoolland, who grew up in China under Mao Zedong, about the many ways that Chinese communism persecutes individuals and crushes opportunity. As elites in the U.S. increasingly look to China for ideas about economic and social governance, we have to remember that country’s abysmal record of human rights violations and grinding poverty. Not only does communism emphatically not work, but the government knows it doesn’t work, yet clings to it anyway because political power is more important than an improved life for the Chinese people. It’s a road that the U.S. must shun at every opportunity.

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Kibbe on Liberty is a weekly podcast with libertarian author, economist, and community organizer Matt Kibbe. As the president of Free the People, Kibbe has decades of experience in the libertarian political sphere, but in these troubled times he believes that open dialogue is needed to bring people together. This means being willing to talk, and especially listen, to those with whom we might not always agree, trying to understand perspectives that might otherwise be foreign to us.

Kibbe on Liberty’s growing roster of guests includes politicians, economists, comedians, writers, radio personalities, activists, journalists, and even a magician or two—with topics of conversation ranging from current affairs to craft beer and the Grateful Dead. So grab a cold one, and settle in for the next hour of Kibbe on Liberty, mostly honest conversations with mostly interesting people.